Life beyond the curtain. Seat 40D SFO>ATL (Photo: Chris McGinnis)
I first noticed I might be a bit claustrophobic at about eight years old. Whenever I was especially obnoxious or irritating to my siblings, I’d get locked in a coat closet for a few minutes. In that tiny, dark space stuffed full of wool coats and mothballs, a sort of panic would set in. After a few minutes of almost ripping the door off its hinges, they’d let me escape.
These days, that same feeling returns when I don’t get the upgrade I was hoping for and end up wedged into a window seat in row 40 on a 757. Only there’s no escape on a five or six hour transcon flight.
And it’s not just the cramped seats….
What really sets me off in this situation is when the person in the seat in front of me reclines his or her seat all the way back. What are these people thinking? Probably something like, “It’s my seat, I paid for it, and I’m going to get every inch out of it.” Apparently, consideration for others in this new age of ever-tightening seat space never enters the equation.
As sort of a karmic protection, I’ve stopped reclining my own seat when flying economy, hoping the person in front of me won’t do it either. But sometimes it doesn’t work, and I find myself much closer to a stranger’s scalp than I really want to be.
Sometimes I have no choice but to just recline as well, risking similarly offending the person in the seat behind me, and perhaps setting off a domino effect all the way to the back of the plane.
Man across aisle reclined his seat in AAs MCE and passenger behind him said easy you just spilled my coffee. Man said not my fault jackass.
— JohnnyJet (@JohnnyJet) May 9, 2017
I have a 6-foot-2 friend who’s a militant anti-recliner. He recalls a recent flight to Seattle in which the guy in front of him immediately reclined his seat after takeoff — then spent most of the flight leaning forward to work. Arrgh! When the guy finally did sit back, my friend positioned his knees squarely in the offending passenger’s kidneys (easy to do with the newer, thinner “slimline” seats).
The average distance between seats is once again on the decline- last week American Airlines said it would reduce pitch in some economy class seats to a severe 29 inches. And as we all know planes are flying fuller than ever. Personal space is at a premium, creating tiny little wars throughout the coach cabin.
Why can’t airlines impose a partial truce by locking seats upright, at least for short flights?
I asked a handful of TravelSkills readers what they think about this. Many — especially taller ones — think it’s high time for a seat-back lockup. “It is already cramped enough at the ‘back of the bus, but to have your space encroached by the person in front of you for that extra two inches of non-space is terrible,” said reader A.E.
Reclining seats can also be a threat to laptop computers. P.B. from Atlanta said his laptop case was cracked “by some yahoo who thrust her seat back full force. … I had the screen resting against that dangerous well that houses the tray table.” Brown now asks for a “recline alert” from the person in front of him when working on his laptop.
Knee room in economy – non existent of passenger reclines (Chris McGinnis)
Some business travelers think a middle road would be best. P.V. suggests airlines adjust the seats so that they recline only half way. Many others suggested locking seats upright for short flights only. T.T. hates government intervention, but he thinks the solution is “a federal regulation providing a minimum amount of space between seats to permit comfortable reclining.”
Despite the recent outcry, complaints and congressional hearing, I doubt we’ll see much action on this issue. The airlines seem much more interested in revenue than comfort in economy class. None of the majors is likely to step out front with a seat lockup that would be criticized by some as another service reduction even though a it could be considered an enhancement. (Only the Ultra-Low-Cost carriers like Spirit and Allegiant have non-reclining seats.)
Maybe the best we can hope for is a little better application of the Golden Rule.
If you don’t like the idea of someone planting their scalp a few inches from your face, don’t do it to the person behind you. Think before you recline. Recline slowly or only halfway.
In the meantime, I’ll be reminded of that coat closet every time I squeeze into my economy seat and have the misfortune of sitting behind a recliner. Unless, of course, I snag a roomy exit row, bulkhead seat or, better yet, luck into an upgrade premium economy or first/business class.
What do you think….Should airlines lock economy seats in the upright position? Halfway? Not at all? Should the feds set seat space standards? Please leave your comments below.
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Rather than attacking each other (tall/short/wide/narrow), why aren’t you complaining about the airlines’ decision to maximize profits over customer experience? I travel for work regularly and often book business class whenever available but surprisingly it is often booked full well in advance. Business travel is frequently short notice and even at only 6′ tall, in coach I literally have to sit with knees split apart to avoid the seat ahead, even before the passenger in front reclines. I don’t consider myself unusually tall so why is that acceptable? Eliminate two rows of seats (lets say 6) with an average price of $500/seat and divide that among paying passengers. The total added cost is likely less than $30 per paying passenger!
They say there’s a sure way to make a small fortune in the airline business: Start with a large fortune. Good luck starting an airline that offers more generous space per passengers. Aircraft have fixed amount of space to work with. More space = less passengers. You must distribute your fixed costs among the passengers you’ve got. Fewer passengers = lower margins or higher prices. American tried More Room Throughout Coach. They abandoned it when people were not willing to pay more. That leaves your only option as lower margins.
Lock the seats. Reclining isn’t necessary in the first place. Nobody will miss it, and we can all just STFU about this problem.
Except the guy in the last row. He gets screwed.
I’m not only taller than most but I’m working on my third million Mile milestone on American.
The airlines are run by private companies, they are not public services. Furthermore tall people CAN FLY CURRENTLY, as evidenced by the complaints in this thread, yours included. Your analogy would be more appropriate if you argued disabled people should get their own minifridge, Xbox and big screen TV on the bus. This is an issue of creature comforts, not the ability to use the service.
Since I’m taller than basically everyone who isn’t in the NBA I have to call you on your BS. Are seats in coach comfortable? No. They aren’t for anyone. The fact that you are tall doesn’t make you a special snowflake entitled to additional accommodation from the airlines.
Disabled people should suck it up and pay for a private shuttle instead of riding the bus too, eh?
You have absolutely no idea what the hell you’re talking about. It’s obvious that you’re probably not very tall, because if you were you’d know very well that the seat in front of you goes back much further than “a trivial fraction of an inch.”
It’s a de facto requirement. I’m not sure how familiar you are with human anatomy or the laws of physics, but there’s a finite amount of space between seats, and there’s a limit to how much you can decrease that space before a leg will no longer fit there, comfortably or not.
You aren’t REQUIRED. If you opt to have more space assigned to you, then you have to pay up like everyone else
You mean bigger people have less free space in any confined area? It’s almost like they are bigger or something…
Baloney. Seats recline at the junction of the seat back and the frame. That’s right where your legs are. That means when your seat back at the headrest goes back 4inches, the seat at the area where your knees are hours back a trivial fraction of an inch. Enough for no one to notice. Unless you are purposefully slouching in your seat and pressing your knees against the seat back already, recline will have no affect on you.
Thank you for providing a different perspective – these seats are one-size-fits-all which generally means they don’t fit anyone very well, short or tall. I am average size and I also feel like the headrest pushes my neck forward in an uncomfortable way – no way am I going to tolerate that for more than 20 minutes.
Why don’t you just recline yours too? If everyone did it, everyone would be more comfortable. Myself and many others find it VERY UNCOMFORTABLE to remain in the upright position for any length of time and it is also impossible to sleep. What would you have us do?
Same here, after a little while, I find the upright position begins to bother my lower back and a little recline alleviates it completely. Sleeping is also impossible when fully upright.
Well in that case you could try politely asking the person in front of you to switch seats with you or to partially de-recline. I paid for my seat the way it was designed and I always double-check that my seat is one of the ones that do in fact recline. If you use seat guru dot com or similar sites, you can see which seats DON’T recline and you can do your best to select the seat behind those.
“…if everyone did it, we would all be a little more comfortable!”
Except for those of us who are over 6′ and are going to have our knees crushed.
Why should I, as a tall person, be required to pay more for my ticket than people of normal height? Being tall isn’t a choice and there’s absolutely nothing I can do about it, so it’s unreasonable to suggest that I should have to pay more for an airline seat than anyone else.
So basically, bigger people should just suck it up and accept that life is going to be more costly inconvenient for them. Got it.
The seats recline hence I am going to use the recline feature. You are free to use it as well. In fact, if everyone did it, we would all be a little more comfortable! To me, the non-recliners are the outliers.
Agree with you completely!
As a non-recliner, I can see both sides of the issue. But can we all agree that you should put your seat upright during the meal? Some flight attendants (usually on foreign carriers) ask passengers to do this. What they really should do is make a general announcement.
Maybe a good cough or twenty as well.
i think this discussion is similar to that of people of size. IF you are too tall to sit in the allotted space then you should be required to purchase the seat in front of you. Isn’t it the same thing as for heavier passengers? You are infringing on someone else’s space. You also have the option of purchasing the seats on the front of the plane with more room or business class. I am only 5″3″ and due to back pain I want to recline. I don’t mind if the person in front of me reclines because my knees don’t reach the next seat. On a recent flight the person behind me pushed my seat forward without even asking. Personally I don’t see what difference it made for her since the seats now only recline a couple inches and she was short. I would have gladly moved my seat if she had asked, since she just pushed me I didn’t budge. On another flight the lady in the middle seat behind me required me to move my seat all the time so she could go to the bathroom every 20-30 minutes. After a while I just faked sleeping. I think everyone should think of everyone else before getting seats. Do I fit in that seat? Will I be bothering someone else with my size or height? Do I have medical conditions that require me to go to the bathroom often? If you do then you need to get seats that fit your needs and if it be you might need to pay for them. BUT do not take it away from other people because you are too tall or , too heavy. I should be able to enjoy all of my seat both in width and on reclining.
The true question is whether the seats that we are provided with actually fit the average american and if they need to be changed in order to provide for the health and safety of passengers.
That’s why I always ask before I recline on long-haul flights. It eliminates all the bad feelings, and the person behind you doesn’t feel like you’re taking their space without asking. I’ve never had anyone ask me not to recline on a very long flight, and I’ve had 100% of the people be grateful that I asked.
Cuts both ways though. I recently paid more for “premium” class on Norwegian for the extra space. I reclined (gently) after dinner, and heard the woman behind say too her companion “I guess I’m stuck here for the rest of the flight”
If she hadnt been catty about it I would have offered to move forward upon request but, given the snideness, I didn’t bother
If more space is that important, because say you are tall, large or claustrophobic, then do not rely on getting an upgrade – pay more for a bigger seat.
That said, I recently took a ten hour flight in a “lie flat” seat and never even reclined it. Upright is best for eating, work and watching movies.
Come on now. There are pleeeennnty of tall business travelers who refuse to check a bag and bring the absolute largest carry-on that they can get away with. Both that carry-on and their briefcase or small bag end up in the overhead just as often as anyone else’s.
And being a short person myself, I can tell you that on many planes, the upright seat has a cushion at the top that pushes my head forward while the seat is upright. It’s very uncomfortable on my neck until we hit cruising altitude and I can recline the seat a bit.
Things are only getting worst. The big question is not locking seats but to figure out some way that the airlines make these seats more comfortable for people without infringing on others.
I have no solution to the problem other than maybe it’s going to take government action to have some limits on how bad a seat will get.
In the past we could protest with our wallet and chose another airline. But since the government allowed all the airlines to merge, we no longer have a choice and these greedy airlines can do whatever they want and make seats as terrible as they are now.
We need government action to help these problems.
I took an ANA flight from Hong Kong to Narita. Instead of reclining like most airline seats, their seats “recline” by sliding forward. A clever solution allowing passengers to recline, but not intrude into their neighbor’s space!
I never knew this was such an issue. I will recline (slowly) and not forcefully as I like to sleep on my flights. I don’t get annoyed if the person in front of me reclines likewise as this is to be expected and normal.
I would love it if seats didn’t recline on domestic flights. Just last week, I was in row 2 on a Southwest 737, and the girl in front of me planted her shoeless feet on the bulkhead and used that leverage to forcefully recline her seat, and then kept slamming herself back into the seat throughout the flight. I personally am a non-recliner. I won’t recline on flights less than 9 hours, and I always ask the person behind me before I do it.
Took several day flights on Allegiant Air MD-80s, where seats do not recline, and loved them!
On longer stay trips I must travel with a laptop, in order to access certain software. No worries on Allegiant that someone would suddenly recline and smash it.
This is not an endorsement of Allegiant. There’s much not to love.
I find that there is a kind of jerk who takes any polite request as a challenge to his or her space and immediately acts out by reclining as fast and far as possible!
So you favor making the airlines richer and the reclining jerks happier?
I think everyone over 10 knows how far the “golden rule” will get us!
There are two kinds of people in the world, those who realize their dogs’ barking all night bothers us or those don’t care, those who are aware of their loud talking in museums is a nightmare and those who don’t care, those who kick back airline reclining seats within one second of the “ding”and those who don’t.
I’d rather sit up straight all night than watch them slam back their seats for one second!
Unfortunately airline seats are designed incorrectly. The bottom seat cushion should slide forward while the seat back should tilt very slightly. The passenger seated behind would barely notice that the person in front was reclining. Meanwhile, the person who wants to tilt their chair has to give up their own legroom to achieve the affect.
I have a bad back. The way current seats are designed the upright position seems designed to aggravate it. If the flight is longer than an hour, I would not be able to fly without the ability to recline. I never jerk back, always recline slowly for the sake of the person behind–and I don’t fly the discount carriers. If airlines want be passenger-friendly to both sides of this battle, redesign seats so the standard position doesn’t need to be reclined. Although that is probably impossible with a 29 inch pitch.
It is not passengers’ responsibility to change their behavior to accommodate the airlines. Thy are the ones trying to make extra money by making us miserable.
Recline away!
It’s all about segmentation, i.e. offering different service levels to different groups of people with different preferences. This could be easily implemented: Just like most airlines have a few rows in “economy plus” with a bit more legroom (for a price), they could have seats that are “locked”. The people sitting behind a “locked” seat pay a bit extra for the extra space they get and the people sitting in the locked seat pay a bit less since their seat doesn’t recline. This would be easy to implement as it’s a matter of putting a simple “lock” on the seat and pair the supply and demand in the reservation system. The locks could be placed by the crew at the beginning of the flight. I personally don’t have a problem sitting behind a reclining seat and would be happy to pay a bit extra for the right to do so.
Get over it. I am 6’3″ and if the person in front of me reclines I recline also. If you pay for a regular economy seat don’t expect a lot of leg room.
Yes they should be locked upright if pitch is below about 34 inches.
YES! Please! I find those who recline to be very rude and I would never do so unless there was no one behind me or a very small child.(For those who want to say “it reclines, so I have a right to do it” have no regard for others.)
I’m not sure what airlines y’all are flying that have seats in coach that recline so much. Fly all the time and don’t have an issue. I am only 6′. It’s not a seat recline issue but a packem’ deep and cheap mentality. I refuse to fly Frontier and Spirit. I do realize everyone is packing them in though.
My son who is 6’9″ shares your feelings. As a young teacher with a family he does not have the option to fly in Business or First.
It is stupid to work a laptop in coach. Your work can wait.
I have been nearly militant in my views on this. At 6’4″ (what I can’t help), and at 260lbs (I agree I can help), I am often miserable on planes with my knees often hitting that metal bar that supports the tray table or an uneven surface of the seatback. I have had ungrateful travelers ignore my repeated requests to please do not recline. I have two solutions, and they should be government imposed because the airlines only want to cram people in to make more money, A). lock all seats on all US domestic flights. Even coast to coast, even red-eyes. B). Enforce a minimum seat pitch, OR make airlines have more sections with leg room. If necessary increase the fares. I wish I could start my own airline – just for big and tall people with plenty of comfort. I’d get rid of all other unnecessary “treats” and focus ONLY on passenger comfort, including space between seats. Can some loan me, hmmm, about $300m so I can fund this start-up? I believe in my heart I can make the economics work. This is ridiculous
I’ve never had to do it myself, but perhaps a hefty, wet sneeze on the offender’s head would produce positive results…
This debate is endless. Sure lock the seats for everyone, but until then I feel like everyone has the right to recline. It does make it much more comfortable for some people. And those who put their drinks or laptops right up against the seat in front of them are not really taking personal responsibility – everyone knows that seats recline – if you are risky enough to put your laptop against it then so be it. Want to work with more room? Then buy a roomier seat or fly a different airline, but don’t think you are more important than the person in front of you. I use my laptop all the time on cramped flights and hold it in my lap or away from the seat enough so their use won’t break my laptop.
All of the major airlines are promoting some variation of “comfort plus” as having 50% greater recline. Since that is selling, I doubt they will stop soon. Short flights on small commuter planes? Definitely lock them. Short flights (~1 hour) lock them on anything. On longer flights, let buyers have a bit of recline. Of course, if they lock the seats for the cheapest flights, then the airlines can upsell to seats that have a recline.
On short to mid length flights, absolutely lock the seats. I do think that there should be some minimum space as well, with AA is going LCC except for the actual price (insert ironic comment here). I should mention that I’m 6’5, and agree heartily with Rob’s comments.
YES!!! The seats are cramped enough without the person ahead of you dropping their seat back into your face.
Yes, yes, absolutely yes.
I love the suggestion of “everyone follow the golden rule”, but unfortunately the world seems to have moved past that. At the very least, first look behind you to see if the seat is occupied, if the person is using a laptop, or if they’re tall. Recline away if there’s a five year old child there, or someone is sound asleep. But if it’s a taller person trying to work, at least have the courtesy to ask first!
I’m 6’4″. I know what it’s like to have seats lowered into my legs (and seemingly into my lap) without even a glance. Some, when I ask, will put their seat part-way back up. Others just sneer.
The interesting thing…
I’ve noticed that tall people – and especially tall business travelers – only very rarely recline. The “recliners” tend to be shorter people who, I suppose, just don’t get it because they don’t feel the effect when they’re on the receiving end.
(I’ve also noticed a similar relationship with overhead bin storage. The people who tend to try to stuff every single one of their small shopping bags and other items into the overhead – leaving underneath their seat 100% empty – are very often shorter people who don’t even need that under-seat space for their feet. I’ve even seen people standing on the aisle seat (because they can’t otherwise reach) rearranging other people’s rollaboards so they can stuff a small duffle up there — their one and only carry-on.)
And it’s one thing to recline your seat in order to sleep, such as on a red eye. But serial ‘recliners’ seem to do it even on short flights, on daytime flights, when they’re trying to watch seatback tv, when they’re eating … it’s pretty much a grab for space as soon as the plane leaves the ground.
Unless it’s a very long haul flight, yes, lock those seats in place, please.
(The only alternative– use the seats where reclining actually pushes your seat-bottom forward, so that your recline comes at the expense of your legroom, not the legroom of others. If airlines used those seats, bring it on!)
“Should airlines lock seats upright?”
No
If AA goes to 29 inches they will most likely have to lock the recline features at least on those rows. 29 inches with recline would not be a good experience. Spirit doesn’t allow recline on their normal seats, which seems essential for anyone who has flown Spirit non-extra legroom seats.
If they are the seats that just recline into the space of the passenger behind, yes of course the seats should be locked. I have sat in Coach where the seat itself slides forward a bit giving more angle to the back, but the space is removed from the one wanting to have the angle not the innocent sitting behind. And no computer or iPad is safe on a table with the reclining seat.